"TheRealBicycleBuck" (therealbicyclebuck)
07/05/2019 at 18:26 • Filed to: None
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"TheRealBicycleBuck" (therealbicyclebuck)
07/05/2019 at 18:26 • Filed to: None | 0
| 16 |
[Update] I pulled out my multimeter, found a video on how to test for continuity, found the manual for my multimeter to see how to do it using my equipment, then started testing wires. I found that of the living room window sensors had an open circuit. So, I climbed into the attic and started chasing down wires. I found them pretty quickly. They looked fine. No chew marks or anything to indicate damage. I followed them all the way to where they penetrate the wall and go to the security system box. No damage.
Totally perplexed, I decided to check the window again. The magnet had fallen off! I would have sworn I checked that last time! Anyway, I reattached the magnet to the window and everything is working fine now.
Thanks for the feedback!
[Original post]
One of th e zones in our security system went offline. I opened the box and discovered they have six sensors wired in series with a resistor on that zone’s circuit. While I’m tempted to just disconnect the zone and start testing wires, I don’t want to fry anything. Any advise before I start mucking about? It’s Zone 4 in the pics and the resistor is wired in series with the red wire going to the ZCOM terminal 113. The green wire is on terminal 14, Zone 4.
Alfalfa
> TheRealBicycleBuck
06/22/2019 at 18:39 |
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Yo u gotta lick each one to see how well they're working.
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TheRealBicycleBuck
> Alfalfa
06/22/2019 at 18:40 |
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:P
WilliamsSW
> TheRealBicycleBuck
06/22/2019 at 19:06 |
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Lol we had a backup battery die on ours and nothing would appease the system.
So I cut the wires to the speakers.
RacinBob
> TheRealBicycleBuck
06/22/2019 at 19:21 |
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Ugh - I am guessing because these questions are kind of fun. Lets say the alarm circuit is one where there is power sent to a sensor, and if the power comes back, no alarm. And if it doesn’t, then there is an alarm.
So when you look at the board, we see terminals marked zones interspaced with terminals marked COM (for common) . I also see that ZCOM 13 has two wires with resistors on it where as ZCOM 16 has one wire with no resistors. I will take a guess and say the function of the resistors is to limit current flow due to having two sensors in parallel.
It’s hard to tell but by my estimation ZCOM13 is the voltage source for both terminal 12-Zone 3 and terminal 14 Zone 4. If it is then I would try swapping the wires between 12 and 14 and see whether the fault follows the wire or if it stays the same. If it follows the wire and zone 3 shows fault, then the fault is in the zone 4 wiring or sensor. If the fault stays with Zone 4, it looks like it is in the circuit board.
One thing that I am not impressed with the blue crimp connection between the resistor and it’s outgoing wire. I would give that connection a wiggle as they crimp connections are not so reliable for low voltage/current applications. The installer should have soldered them together.
Another thing you could do is disconnect a known good zone and measure the voltage between it’s wire and the zone terminal. I assume you will find 12 volts DC or so. Then do it for the dead zone between it and Zone 3 and also between it and zone 4. and I assume you will find no voltage for either.
Let us know what you find.
PS, I assume we are playing with low voltage like 12 volts or less but It’s always worth looking at what voltage is in there says the guy who shocked himself with 220 volts when messing around with his AC controls......
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TheRealBicycleBuck
> RacinBob
06/22/2019 at 19:29 |
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Thanks. I’m sure planning to dig into again in the morning.
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TheRealBicycleBuck
> WilliamsSW
06/22/2019 at 19:46 |
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That happened to us last year. The local battery store had a replacement for $20.
Honeybunchesofgoats
> TheRealBicycleBuck
06/22/2019 at 20:01 |
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Remove the whole thing and mail it to this guy: https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCtM5z2gkrGRuWd0JQMx76qA and wait for him to diagram it for you.
66P1800inpieces
> RacinBob
06/26/2019 at 09:38 |
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No one solders and tapes. Crimp connections are really reliable for anything smaller than 18g. Those crimps have little teeth on the inside and for smaller gauges I don’t think you need to strip the wires although you always should strip them first. W hile not the cause of the current problem, EOL resistors belong at the End Of Line, not by the panel. This way you can use a volt meter to see if their is an open short, or if everything is fine, you would see the resistor telling you the wire is good.
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RacinBob
> 66P1800inpieces
06/26/2019 at 13:54 |
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Why is it then that the doubled up commons have end of line resistors but the single one doesn’t?
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66P1800inpieces
> RacinBob
06/26/2019 at 18:12 |
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I am guessing that for that one zone the installer put it correctly out in the field. T he ones with resistors in the panel are probably doors or windows, and the one without is a motion detector as you can often fit the resistor in the case. Some motions even have a dummy terminal that you can use instead of a butt connector. The blue connectors in your picture are butt connectors or b connectors. Those zones dont really carry any voltage so you can take off the one lead for the zone in question and put it under an other zone. All commons are shared so you dont need to move them. I dont recognize that panel (Napco?) but often times zone 1 is the loop for smoke detectors. That one can also be used as a regular zone but don’t play with it because it is powered, and because if used for a smoke alarm it will send a trouble signal to the central system. If you are worried about signals going out if it is connected to a central station you can call them up and place it on “test” for a couple hours before you mess around.
Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
> TheRealBicycleBuck
07/05/2019 at 19:49 |
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Chuck all of that and get a dog. Just a thought...
What spurred you to alarm your home?
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TheRealBicycleBuck
> Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
07/05/2019 at 20:08 |
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It was fully wired when we bought it. There are some nefarious characters in the area and we’ve had a few burglaries on our block over the years. One night, a fellow hit several houses and cars. He left his pliers in my truck. There wasn’t anything to steal. Last year, I found a bullet hole in my roof.
The most valuable thing the alarm has done was notify the fire department when my wife left a pan of eggs boiling on the stove. It kept the dogs from dying of smoke inhalation and prevented the start of a more serious fire.
Oh yeah, dogs. We’ve had a big dog and a little dog in the house since we moved here. Even the police have said they weren’t willing to enter our house or yard as long as the big dog is here. She’s pretty intimidating.
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Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
> TheRealBicycleBuck
07/05/2019 at 21:23 |
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Bullet hole, eh? Lovely.
I’ve been told video does little to solve or convict or prevent crime.
Cool about the Fire Department. If I had such a system, I’d want it hard wired and I’d probably insist upon wiring it myself. All this IOT stuff I want zero to do with.
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TheRealBicycleBuck
> Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
07/05/2019 at 21:57 |
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Same with us. I found a hybrid system that uses a smart hub to provide internet connectivity without having to depend on either a completely wireless system or one of the big two (Alexa or Google home) for video storage. I haven’t committed to it yet, but it’s a top contender. I’m meeting with a friend of a friend to talk about other options. He provides lighting and surveillance at construction sites. He has direct connections to some excellent camera suppliers.
GLiddy
> RacinBob
07/09/2019 at 09:22 |
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Yeah, I’m replying to an old thread, but just a bit of info:
The resistors are in the circuit as they are used to ‘split’ zones. (At least that is what is done in my system.) In the old days your alarm circuits were simple closed loops. Now they use a high tolerance resistor in each circuit. In fact, if the system supports it, you can split each zone by running 2 circuits in parallel that are terminated with 2 different resistor values. Say one circuit is a 100 Ohm termination and the other is 200 Ohm termination. In the normal state, the alarm sees 67 Ohms and knows both circuits are fine. Now if someone breaks the 100 Ohm circuit, the alarm now measures 200 Ohms and knows that the 100 Ohm circuit is broken. (And vice versa).
The guy who wired this alarm did it wrong. You do NOT put your terminating resistors at the panel. It negates the tamper resistance that using such a system provides. If someone gained access to a zone wire, they can simply short circuit a zone and isolate the sensors downstream of the short. If the terminator is at the end of the string, then a short will be detected by the system. You cannot ‘jump’ this system like you see in the movies if you put your terminator at the end of your loop...but you can if its at the box.
I wired my own system and while the firmware did not support zone splitting (I can upgrade if I want) I still wired it with upgrading in mind. Each ‘zone’ consists of two runs of sensors terminated with the resistors specified as if I had a split zone system. Clear as mud?
One more thing. It seems that you fixed your problem so you don’t have this issue, but since I did my system myself, I ordered a spool of alarm cable from an Ebay seller. Everything was fine with it for maybe 8 or 9 years and then one of my zones failed. I finally tracked it down, and discovered that my alarm cable was garbage. It is cheap fake Chinese wire that is breaking down. It is not copper, but is some other metal that is corroding and brittle and the insulation is crumbling. This is a huge problem as I’m not as young as I used to be and in the years since I installed it, I’ve covered over much of the wiring in a subsequent basement remodel.
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RacinBob
> GLiddy
07/09/2019 at 19:03 |
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A well written and insightful reply. I learned something. thanks!